Wow seriously?

[Stormboy]

People can be so selfish and heartless these days. They have enough money for Samsung Galaxy S4, iPhone and other shit but $1 is "too much of a money" to give to a homeless.
http://youtube.com/watch?v=2Rsc-2oMB0s

[N36fSL3A]

It's because people believe that the homeless choose not to work and are just lazy, not that they're selfish beasts. It's why people debate on why people should receive free health care.

It's not like they don't care... They just feel like they shouldn't have to take care of lazy freeloaders, and they shouldn't. That being said, not are homeless people are lazy, but just a few in the bunch spoil their public perception.

[giblit]

I would never give a panhandler money. I've seen so many of them get into really nice vehicles after receiving their days pay. Also how is spending one's earned money how they want selfish/heartless I would say it is selfish to be dependent on others for income.

[N36fSL3A]

The post above further illustrates my point. Just those few that are lazy bums ruin the public perception.

giblit wrote:

I would say it is selfish to be dependent on others for income.

You have to realize that some people simply cannot get a job. It isn't like they are lazy, but nobody wants to hire/can hire them. I feel as if we've reached that point in time where there are too little jobs and too many people.

[Stormboy]

@ Fredbill: That can apply to an adult. But a child?
@ giblit: People can spend their income on what they want, I'm not objecting against that. I'm saying that its selfish and heartless that they have the money but can't give even a less amount to a homeless kid.

[N36fSL3A]

Stormboy wrote:

@ Fredbill: That can apply to an adult. But a child?

There is still that same possibility that they're getting a share of someone who devised a larger scheme. My statements are still valid.

[Stormboy]

Fredbill, that doesn't even make sense.

[chrisname]

giblit wrote:

I would never give a panhandler money. I've seen so many of them get into really nice vehicles after receiving their days pay

Surely it would be better to give 100 people $10 each to find that 99 of them were conmen than to give 100 people nothing to find that 99 of them were starving. Assume you could afford the $1000.

I would say it is selfish to be dependent on others for income.

How is it selfish? Selfishness is putting oneself before others; relying on others when you have no other options isn't selfish, it's basic survival. Homeless people generally don't want to be dependent on others -- I imagine it's quite humiliating. But some of them are mentally ill and others are just at a temporary bottom -- I read that most homeless people are only on the streets for around two months of their lives on average. I also read that around 1/3 of New York City's homeless have jobs, but they simply can't afford any sort of accommodation because they can't get enough hours to accumulate the amount of money that a human needs in order to live. And if you lose your job, and subsequently your home, you're doubly screwed because you need an address to get a job. So, telling homeless people to "get a job" doesn't really help when you consider that 1/3 of them have jobs, and the other 2/3 can't possibly get them (and even if they could, they would still have to compete with people with homes, people who can wear clean clothes to the interview and can prepare properly because they don't have to spend the day scrounging for food).

[Little Bobby Tables]

You have to realize that some people simply cannot get a job. It isn't like they are lazy, but nobody wants to hire/can hire them. I feel as if we've reached that point in time where there are too little jobs and too many people.

that can absolutely apply to a child

I'm saying that its selfish and heartless that they have the money but can't give even a less amount to a homeless kid.

how do you know that any given kid is homeless and not just acting?

here is still that same possibility that they're getting a share of someone who devised a larger scheme. My statements are still valid.

Fredbill, that doesn't even make sense.

sure it does. hes saying that they could just be acting to get money and still have another source of income

[Stormboy]

There is a difference between a face of real desperation and a face of acted-out desperation. One doesn't cry simply even if they want to. You can make a person laugh easily but making them cry isn't that easy unless you are a badass :P.

[giblit]

You can make a person laugh easily but making them cry isn't that easy unless you are a badass :P.

Making someone cry has nothing to do with being "badass"?

[BHX]

giblit wrote:

I would say it is selfish to be dependent on others for income.

Then you were selfish from birth to 18?

This topic is difficult to address. There are homeless that do get help for legit reasons, there are some who do it just to get drugs or booze, there are some that aren't even homeless and are doing it because they don't want to work (like all the people in my town), others can't get work, etc. There are so many variables that you could discuss this until you are old and grey. People do things for so many different reasons (including because they have no other choice).

Stormboy wrote:

That can apply to an adult. But a child?

Usually it is a child put up to it by the adult as some adults know kids provoke more sympathy than adults do. Some run away from home and resort to begging for money or prostitution (depending on the city they run away to). Again so many variables to consider.

[Stormboy]

@ giblit: If you are a badass it'd be easier for you to make someone cry.

[Little Bobby Tables]

i dont think you know what a badass is stormboy

[htirwin]

Well the kid in the video was faking it, and there was a camera crew close by filming the whole thing. Maybe the people who didn't donate were just keen enough to know it was a setup or a scam.

And if everyone donated, the kid could make thousands of dollars in a day. So even in a serious situation would it be fair to single out each person who walks by without giving anything as uncompassionate.

The right thing to do would probably be to buy the kid a large jar of peanut butter and a loaf of bread.

With that in mind I think hungry people should stand near grocery stores or markets and ask for food instead of money.

[Disch]

Fredbill wrote:

That being said, not are homeless people are lazy, but just a few in the bunch spoil their public perception.

I think you have it backwards, Fredbill. yes there are some homeless people who are genuinely just down on their luck and have no other options... but they are greatly in the minority.

Most of the ones I've interacted with (which has been several ... I have lived in 2 very liberal cities with lots of bums) were clearly substance abusers who undoubtedly drove their own fate into the ditch, literally.

I've given money to panhandlers before. Each and every time I regretted it almost immediately after.

I'll tell you the story:

One time, when I was living in Berkeley... I had no job, no money, and was sharing a very small apt with my sister and one other roommate. I drank a lot of Mountain Dew back then... and my sister gave me $2 to go buy a 2-liter down at the corner store.

So I take the walk... like 8 or 9 blocks down the road. And right outside the store a homeless guy stops me. Gives me a big spiel about how he needs money to help him get ready for a job interview he has the next day or something. He says he's trying to raise $20.

I even believe him (I was young). So I explain my situation. That I only have this $2, and that it was my 'soda money' and that I'll give him the $2 but it means that I can't get my caffeine fix... because I thought helping him was more important.

So after I hand over the money... he tries to get more out of me. Not even a thanks... just "I really need $20". I try to explain that I don't have $20... that I only had the $2 I just gave him... and that I didn't even really have that money... it was money I got from my sister.

His next approach? "Go get more money from your sister."

So I calmly explain that she gave me that money for soda and that she wouldn't give me $18 more.

His next approach? "She doesn't have to know about it."

So I flat out say "I'm not going to steal from my sister for you."

His next approach? "It wouldn't be stealing."

I'm not making any of this up, by the way. This really happened.


So at this point... it finally sunk in that this guy was a complete piece of shit and that he was lying about everything... and was just trying to take advantage of a kind-hearted, naïve kid.

If I had the balls back then I would have taken my $2 back, bought my soda, and started drinking it right in front of him. But I was too timid, and instead I just moped back home feeling like shit for getting basically conned out of the only money I was going to have all week.



Sadly... this was not really an isolated incident. I have at least 2 other "bums suck" stories. But I'll spare you guys. What's more... I see a lot of panhandling by people who aren't even homeless. Like one of my sister's ex-boyfriends.



So yeah... the reality is that most (though granted not all) bums are either substance abusers, or people with severe mental problems. Giving those people a few bucks is not going to turn their life around. It's basically just throwing your money away. I'll never, ever do it again. I've been burned way too many times.

StormBoy wrote:

I'm saying that its selfish and heartless that they have the money but can't give even a less amount to a homeless kid.

I didn't watch the video (at work), but most (all?) states have group homes kids under 18 can go to. If that kid is really homeless, all he has to do it go to a police officer and ask for help. Obviously it's not ideal and is kind of shitty... but it's better than being on the street.

Though if the kid is 18+, then he definitely has fewer options.

[Little Bobby Tables]

wow disch... that must have really bummed you out

[N36fSL3A]

I did not know it was like that. From all the homeless people I've seen (volunteered at a shelter), they were legitimately homeless, but they did eventually end up getting back on their feet.

I guess I just haven't seen enough of the world yet.

Stormboy wrote:

There is a difference between a face of real desperation and a face of acted-out desperation. One doesn't cry simply even if they want to. You can make a person laugh easily but making them cry isn't that easy unless you are a badass :P.

Not really the type of person to do so, but it isn't hard to lie and take advantage of people to get their money.

[Stormboy]

@ Disch: Wow that's some pahandler. I think he probably was raising $20 for drugs. Nevertheless, you can usually never know whether a person is in fact homeless or is faking it, so why not give him a few bucks or so. Atleast it'd be satisfying that IF he was really helpless, you've helped him out.

[htirwin]

Atleast it'd be satisfying that IF he was really helpless, you've helped him out.

Sometimes people have a desperate moment or two where they legitimately need help. Most bums panhandle all the time and survive off of it while maintaining their drug or alcohol addictions. You shouldn't enable them. The less money they make, the less they have to spend on drugs.

I have had an experience with a person who was a drug addict. The worst thing that you could do for him was give him money; next thing you knew he would be tweaking heavily and getting into the most bizarre and dangerous situations.

That's why I would never give a panhandler money, unless I think I can recognize their legitimacy somehow, but that is very rare.

A kid I might give money to but I have never seen a young homeless kid asking for money. Probably I would buy them some food, maybe ask them what there situation was; maybe their parents are broke and don't feed them. When I was a kid I knew some kids who had drug addict parents who didn't properly feed their children. It's pretty sad when kids have to worry so much about getting food.