Guilt is a selfish feeling (for me)
@chrisname
That's interesting, because it contributes further to an idea that I've been creating over the past few months. I feel like personalities naturally align. It's apparent that somehow, subconsciously, we're all attracted to certain fields or activities. What I've been noticing recently is that the fields that we're led to are full of people with extremely similar personality traits.
I'm noticing this because this semester I'm doing some weird shit at school and taking a class intended for biology majors (because I felt like it). It was a really weird experience, the first class period I was there, because I could almost feel difference in the air. Everyone's personality is shockingly different from the engineering crowd I typically hang out with, but different in such a way that they are all similar (if that makes any sense at all. As you can see, I'm still working this out in my head)
So it wouldn't surprise me if most of the regulars on this forum identify with my personality (and lack of sympathy) as you and ResidentBiscuit have.
I can agree mostly with what you have to say about personality disorders. Aside from the label, because I recognize that casting a negative view isn't the intent, the treatments are what I have a problem with. And it's not for all personality disorders. Things like paranoid schizophrenia need to be treated in order for a person to be self-sufficient, except in the few cases where a person benefits mentally and personally from the presence of hallucinations. I might have generalized my experiences with ADD, and ADHD too much. Too often I've been around children (young enough that they're not capable of making decisions on their own) that have been "diagnosed" with ADHD and thrown on something like Adderall or Focalin because their parents don't want to discipline them. I extremely disagree with that.
That's not to say that there aren't cases of ADHD that require medication; i'm not trying to invalidate the disorder, just to express what i feel is an abuse of medication.
I wasn't disputing the fact that mediation can do very good things for people. If you need medication in order to function, then by all means. Who am I to argue against that.
I'm just generally against the use of medicines unless absolutely necessary.
That's interesting, because it contributes further to an idea that I've been creating over the past few months. I feel like personalities naturally align. It's apparent that somehow, subconsciously, we're all attracted to certain fields or activities. What I've been noticing recently is that the fields that we're led to are full of people with extremely similar personality traits.
I'm noticing this because this semester I'm doing some weird shit at school and taking a class intended for biology majors (because I felt like it). It was a really weird experience, the first class period I was there, because I could almost feel difference in the air. Everyone's personality is shockingly different from the engineering crowd I typically hang out with, but different in such a way that they are all similar (if that makes any sense at all. As you can see, I'm still working this out in my head)
So it wouldn't surprise me if most of the regulars on this forum identify with my personality (and lack of sympathy) as you and ResidentBiscuit have.
I can agree mostly with what you have to say about personality disorders. Aside from the label, because I recognize that casting a negative view isn't the intent, the treatments are what I have a problem with. And it's not for all personality disorders. Things like paranoid schizophrenia need to be treated in order for a person to be self-sufficient, except in the few cases where a person benefits mentally and personally from the presence of hallucinations. I might have generalized my experiences with ADD, and ADHD too much. Too often I've been around children (young enough that they're not capable of making decisions on their own) that have been "diagnosed" with ADHD and thrown on something like Adderall or Focalin because their parents don't want to discipline them. I extremely disagree with that.
That's not to say that there aren't cases of ADHD that require medication; i'm not trying to invalidate the disorder, just to express what i feel is an abuse of medication.
I wasn't disputing the fact that mediation can do very good things for people. If you need medication in order to function, then by all means. Who am I to argue against that.
I'm just generally against the use of medicines unless absolutely necessary.
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i tottaly agree with what you guys say, i should be allowed to be myself and not alter myself with drugs, but we didn't make this society, and it cant work perfectly for everyone, ritalin doesnt make me feel better at all but it does sync me up so i can survive.
Really the only job an unmedicated ADHD person can do consistently is basic cheffing, you dont have to get up early, the stress hides shouting and mad behaviour and if your fired or trash the place in a hissy fit, or shout at useless people til they cry and get ejected its quite normal too, its a high turn out rate, you can show up be useless get paid get fired a bit later and repeat the sorry process for the rest of your life, thats proly why its the profession with one of the highest suicide rates, i will help any of you guys out if you take a kitchen job too, just ask.
Or you can take ritalin and do what you want.
Really the only job an unmedicated ADHD person can do consistently is basic cheffing, you dont have to get up early, the stress hides shouting and mad behaviour and if your fired or trash the place in a hissy fit, or shout at useless people til they cry and get ejected its quite normal too, its a high turn out rate, you can show up be useless get paid get fired a bit later and repeat the sorry process for the rest of your life, thats proly why its the profession with one of the highest suicide rates, i will help any of you guys out if you take a kitchen job too, just ask.
Or you can take ritalin and do what you want.
@thumper, I noticed this too, go to a pub similar characters, wonder into beauty therapy studio in colledge similar characters again, meet a load of bikers they are usually a mixed bag of the same kind of crazy, crims, junkies and physisists all these people i met all have little bits in common, it might just be tribal, ive seen groups of freinds walk down the high street and they all make similar noises, maybe they learn a certain amount of social behavior ticks from each other, maybie they gravitated towards each other cos of similar personality traits.
Maybe we are like a really complex hive and instead of having workers soldiers drones and a queen (dude are we hive creatures?) we have genetic; runners, engineers, cooks, soldiers, doctors, farmers, moral-raisers, leaders and occasionaly it goes wrong and we get psychopaths... maybe they have a role...just a thought
also maybe this is why mankind gets along with canine kind so well, apparently we have very similar awareness, you know they have evolved to read our body language!
Maybe we are like a really complex hive and instead of having workers soldiers drones and a queen (dude are we hive creatures?) we have genetic; runners, engineers, cooks, soldiers, doctors, farmers, moral-raisers, leaders and occasionaly it goes wrong and we get psychopaths... maybe they have a role...just a thought
also maybe this is why mankind gets along with canine kind so well, apparently we have very similar awareness, you know they have evolved to read our body language!
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closed account (3qX21hU5)
I'm sorry but, I'm one of those people that don't really believe that people have ADHD in most cases and usually they are diagnosed wrong. Sure their mind can wander and they can lose concentration easily but I believe these problems stem from a lack of self control. I'll probably catch a lot of grief from this, and I'm not trying to offend anyone just wanted to post my opinion. And see how others feel about this.
Like I was saying I believe ADHD which is being diagnosed more and more often as the years go by is caused from a lack of self control. The lack of self control could come from many different sources. One example is lack of childhood discipline, or "being spoil" or "babied" by a parent/parents. So the children grow up knowing that type of lifestyle and when they get to school they slack off and don't do much of their work. Then the teachers start to notice and think there might be something wrong. One of the first things they always suspect is ADHD and usually they get proscribed it without a thorough screening process. This was me when I was younger, I was diagnosed ADHD when I really wasn't (At least I think I wasn't) just because I didn't want to do anything in school.
Also did you know that, schools have an incentive to get children diagnosed as it means more money coming from the federal government. Parent(s) of the diagnosed child also receive a $3,000 tax credit. So there are incentives for them to diagnose when children aren't (It seems cruel but it does happen).
Also that is only one example, another is high school kids acting like they have ADHD just so they can get Adderal, Ridilin, and all that to get high. When I went to highschool I knew plenty of kids that did ADHD medicine like Ridilin to get high and I was among them.
I just believe we are not looking at the base problems in children these days and just jumping straight towards medication without thinking how it will affect them (Drug addiction, side effects, and other stuff). Now there are the few that need the medication to actually live a life, but I believe most don't need it.
That demonstrates perfectly what I am trying to say. I don't know you devonrevenge or what your circumstance is and everything, but it seems like you are blaming ADHD whenever you get angry and shout, or get stressed out, or trash a place in a rage, or just be lazy. Now most of them are probably because of some underlying issue other then the ADHD. Again not trying to point a finger at you or anything and not trying to put you down or anything.
But ya that is my thoughts on how I believe we are coming up with illnesses left and right these days and then medicating people because they aren't "normal".
Like I was saying I believe ADHD which is being diagnosed more and more often as the years go by is caused from a lack of self control. The lack of self control could come from many different sources. One example is lack of childhood discipline, or "being spoil" or "babied" by a parent/parents. So the children grow up knowing that type of lifestyle and when they get to school they slack off and don't do much of their work. Then the teachers start to notice and think there might be something wrong. One of the first things they always suspect is ADHD and usually they get proscribed it without a thorough screening process. This was me when I was younger, I was diagnosed ADHD when I really wasn't (At least I think I wasn't) just because I didn't want to do anything in school.
Also did you know that, schools have an incentive to get children diagnosed as it means more money coming from the federal government. Parent(s) of the diagnosed child also receive a $3,000 tax credit. So there are incentives for them to diagnose when children aren't (It seems cruel but it does happen).
Also that is only one example, another is high school kids acting like they have ADHD just so they can get Adderal, Ridilin, and all that to get high. When I went to highschool I knew plenty of kids that did ADHD medicine like Ridilin to get high and I was among them.
I just believe we are not looking at the base problems in children these days and just jumping straight towards medication without thinking how it will affect them (Drug addiction, side effects, and other stuff). Now there are the few that need the medication to actually live a life, but I believe most don't need it.
| Really the only job an unmedicated ADHD person can do consistently is basic cheffing, you dont have to get up early, the stress hides shouting and mad behaviour and if your fired or trash the place in a hissy fit, or shout at useless people til they cry and get ejected its quite normal too, its a high turn out rate, you can show up be useless get paid get fired a bit later and repeat the sorry process for the rest of your life, thats proly why its the profession with one of the highest suicide rates, i will help any of you guys out if you take a kitchen job too, just ask. Or you can take ritalin and do what you want. |
That demonstrates perfectly what I am trying to say. I don't know you devonrevenge or what your circumstance is and everything, but it seems like you are blaming ADHD whenever you get angry and shout, or get stressed out, or trash a place in a rage, or just be lazy. Now most of them are probably because of some underlying issue other then the ADHD. Again not trying to point a finger at you or anything and not trying to put you down or anything.
But ya that is my thoughts on how I believe we are coming up with illnesses left and right these days and then medicating people because they aren't "normal".
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@Thumper 1:18pm "Things like stress, and being upset just don't click in my mind."
I used to get really stressed out all the time. I, being logical to the extreme, could not understand why people were mean, why the were insulting, why there was anything even close to evil in the world. I just couldn't understand it, and it bothered me very much. Now, though, I know it's because not everyone follows logic :p but that doesn't stop me from being annoyed or getting extremely stressed out when people don't understand me or refuse to even consider what I am saying.
It is interesting though that the only thing that gives me what I feel as true emotion is not being able to apply logic to get a correct answer.
@Thumper 1:37pm "I refuse to give any physical event credit for my quirks. It's much more comforting to me to believe that I am because I am. I can't remember a time where I wasn't."
I think that the way our brain processes information is based on genetics, but the choices we make (our opinions) and the habits we follow when in public (our personality) are determined by experiences when we are young. This is just what I think, not something I remember reading or hearing about.
After reading some more posts, it seems like more and more people here are like me in that we don't actually feel emotions but we have a pretty good idea of what they're supposed to feel like and we think other people feel actually do feel them.
I am fully aware of the exact reasons for the way I feel, and not surprisingly, they're all either logically based or brain/chemical based (wanting to eat something that tastes good, etc.)
As for medication and such, I think that you should only do what makes you more effective at what you want to accomplish, not what you think other people expect you to be.
@Thumper 2:58pm "personalities align"
...because for survival reasons we are attracted to things that are like us and that we understand and can predict.
@Zereo 4:41pm
I was diagnosed with ADHD part way through second grade. I cannot focus on one thing for an extended period of time even if I want to, and I have impulses to do random things. I've gotten really good at controlling the impulses (that's something the medicine doesn't help with), and the medicine allows me to control what I focus on. I consider it a disorder because it is a. not suitable to today's society and b. is unfavorable in terms of a survival trait.
I have a considerable amount of self control, but I cannot stay focused on one thing without my medicine. Even when playing an enjoyable game, I zone out and think about something else, usually related, but sometimes even random. I don't think self-control has anything to do with the way ADHD affects your ability to focus. It helps for the impulses, but not focusing.
I am really enjoying this thread, I feel like I'm not crazy any more and that the thoughts I have are valid.
I used to get really stressed out all the time. I, being logical to the extreme, could not understand why people were mean, why the were insulting, why there was anything even close to evil in the world. I just couldn't understand it, and it bothered me very much. Now, though, I know it's because not everyone follows logic :p but that doesn't stop me from being annoyed or getting extremely stressed out when people don't understand me or refuse to even consider what I am saying.
It is interesting though that the only thing that gives me what I feel as true emotion is not being able to apply logic to get a correct answer.
@Thumper 1:37pm "I refuse to give any physical event credit for my quirks. It's much more comforting to me to believe that I am because I am. I can't remember a time where I wasn't."
I think that the way our brain processes information is based on genetics, but the choices we make (our opinions) and the habits we follow when in public (our personality) are determined by experiences when we are young. This is just what I think, not something I remember reading or hearing about.
After reading some more posts, it seems like more and more people here are like me in that we don't actually feel emotions but we have a pretty good idea of what they're supposed to feel like and we think other people feel actually do feel them.
I am fully aware of the exact reasons for the way I feel, and not surprisingly, they're all either logically based or brain/chemical based (wanting to eat something that tastes good, etc.)
As for medication and such, I think that you should only do what makes you more effective at what you want to accomplish, not what you think other people expect you to be.
@Thumper 2:58pm "personalities align"
...because for survival reasons we are attracted to things that are like us and that we understand and can predict.
@Zereo 4:41pm
I was diagnosed with ADHD part way through second grade. I cannot focus on one thing for an extended period of time even if I want to, and I have impulses to do random things. I've gotten really good at controlling the impulses (that's something the medicine doesn't help with), and the medicine allows me to control what I focus on. I consider it a disorder because it is a. not suitable to today's society and b. is unfavorable in terms of a survival trait.
I have a considerable amount of self control, but I cannot stay focused on one thing without my medicine. Even when playing an enjoyable game, I zone out and think about something else, usually related, but sometimes even random. I don't think self-control has anything to do with the way ADHD affects your ability to focus. It helps for the impulses, but not focusing.
I am really enjoying this thread, I feel like I'm not crazy any more and that the thoughts I have are valid.
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closed account (3qX21hU5)
| As for medication and such, I think that you should only do what makes you more effective at what you want to accomplish, not what you think other people expect you to be. |
Well I could do cocaine or even Ridilin and probably program a lot better then I could without it, since I would have more energy ect. That doesn't mean I need it or that it is good for me. Same goes for steroids and sports. Just because it makes you better at something doesn't mean you need.
| I have a considerable amount of self control, but I cannot stay focused on one thing without my medicine. Even when playing an enjoyable game, I zone out and think about something else, usually related, but sometimes even random. I don't think self-control has anything to do with the way ADHD affects your ability to focus. It helps for the impulses, but not focusing. |
Again wasn't singling out any one person when for what I was posting. I meant society in general. We are beginning to just hand out medication to people that don't necessarily need it and tell them they are all fixed. And self control has a lot to do with the way ADHD affects your ability to focus. Now I never said that ADHD isn't real, but I think probably at least half of the people diagnosed with it don't have it now days. A lot of them just have no self control, or discipline. Now that doesn't mean everyone.
| devonrevenge wrote: |
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| dude are we hive creatures? |
| Zereo wrote: |
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| I just believe we are not looking at the base problems in children these days |
| L B wrote: |
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| Now, though, I know it's because not everyone follows logic |
| L B wrote: |
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| it seems like more and more people here are like me in that we don't actually feel emotions but we have a pretty good idea of what they're supposed to feel like and we think other people feel actually do feel them. |
Everything is so connected.
| L B wrote: |
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| I feel like I'm not crazy any more |
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Let me rephrase that; I feel like I'm not the only one anymore.
Heh, when I was writing this post I was going back and forth between this and writing an autonomous program for one of my team's robots in robotics club at school. This wasn't an ADHD-induced loss of focus.
| LB wrote: |
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| other people feel actually do feel them. |
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In America everything is over diagnosed, its money for pills.
But ADHD is real its not even open for discussion, its visible in a brain scan, in some ways it is similar to shellshock, shellshock can put you in a coma!! so strange.
ADHD is autistic spectrum its visible by looking at dopamine production and distribution, it is also simply by doing experiments on people with ADHD and a control group, people with ADHD struggled...this is enough to offer medication to those that need it or have to take it.
Other things that cant be named or pinpointed happen to peoples brains too, and in order to get help the head shrinkers got to give it a name in order to deal with it, unfortunatley everyones gonna report better life managment on amphetamines
oh no say what you like zereo, the more critical you guys are the more i learn, i respect that...its easy with internet anonymity, i dont get embaressed
But ADHD is real its not even open for discussion, its visible in a brain scan, in some ways it is similar to shellshock, shellshock can put you in a coma!! so strange.
ADHD is autistic spectrum its visible by looking at dopamine production and distribution, it is also simply by doing experiments on people with ADHD and a control group, people with ADHD struggled...this is enough to offer medication to those that need it or have to take it.
Other things that cant be named or pinpointed happen to peoples brains too, and in order to get help the head shrinkers got to give it a name in order to deal with it, unfortunatley everyones gonna report better life managment on amphetamines
oh no say what you like zereo, the more critical you guys are the more i learn, i respect that...its easy with internet anonymity, i dont get embaressed
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closed account (3qX21hU5)
First I would like to point out I never said ADHD isn't real nor did anyone else. What I did say was people that don't have ADHD are being diagnosed with it for a variety of reasons. Like people addicted to meth, or other uppers, I i'm a recovering addict myself and I knew plenty of people that just went into the docter and said they had trouble concentrating and walked out diagnosed with ADHD. All of them told me the only reason they did it was to get ridilin or Adderol (However you spell it) for when they didn't have meth or their drug of choice.
Just because they struggled in a control group doesn't mean they have ADHD. It could be a number of things, like anxiety and other causes. They just don't put enough testing into it. I mean most people that get diagnosed with ADHD don't even see a consular just go in every month to get there medication.
This is just plain false. Amphetamines totally screw up a lot of peoples life. Not every person reacts the same to Amphetamines. Like for example if they do have ADHD the medication would "calm" them down and help them think better, but if they don't have ADHD it acts as a upper and makes them much more energetic, and produces a "high" this is why ADHD medication is one of the most abused drugs in teenagers. So no not everyone will have better life management on amphetamines in fact most people's life are ruined on amphetamines.
Non of what I said was directed or ment to be directed at you, so I don't know where this is coming from.
| it is also simply by doing experiments on people with ADHD and a control group, people with ADHD struggled...this is enough to offer medication to those that need it or have to take it. |
Just because they struggled in a control group doesn't mean they have ADHD. It could be a number of things, like anxiety and other causes. They just don't put enough testing into it. I mean most people that get diagnosed with ADHD don't even see a consular just go in every month to get there medication.
| unfortunatley everyones gonna report better life managment on amphetamines |
This is just plain false. Amphetamines totally screw up a lot of peoples life. Not every person reacts the same to Amphetamines. Like for example if they do have ADHD the medication would "calm" them down and help them think better, but if they don't have ADHD it acts as a upper and makes them much more energetic, and produces a "high" this is why ADHD medication is one of the most abused drugs in teenagers. So no not everyone will have better life management on amphetamines in fact most people's life are ruined on amphetamines.
| oh no say what you like zereo, the more critical you guys are the more i learn, i respect that...its easy with internet anonymity, i dont get embaressed |
Non of what I said was directed or ment to be directed at you, so I don't know where this is coming from.
Yeah, sadly ADD and ADHD are considered umbrella diagnoses because of the fact that doctors will diagnose people as having it when they don't. As Zereo just pointed out.
Here's something new: When a puppy dies, I feel annoyed.
A puppy dies
I don't care
And then I remember other people do care
And I worry because I might have to pretend to care
And that annoys me.
Yes, a puppy died, that's terrible, but what does that have to do with anything at all?
My mom can't stand to watch those animal abuse commercials. I don't understand why they bother - they don't do anything annoying, they don't play loud noise, they don't show rapidly blinking or nonsensical images like cartoon network does, so what's the issue?
And I always feel guilty because of this, because it's selfish because I only care about stuff that affects me in some way. I feel guilty all the time and it's annoying!
A puppy dies
I don't care
And then I remember other people do care
And I worry because I might have to pretend to care
And that annoys me.
Yes, a puppy died, that's terrible, but what does that have to do with anything at all?
My mom can't stand to watch those animal abuse commercials. I don't understand why they bother - they don't do anything annoying, they don't play loud noise, they don't show rapidly blinking or nonsensical images like cartoon network does, so what's the issue?
And I always feel guilty because of this, because it's selfish because I only care about stuff that affects me in some way. I feel guilty all the time and it's annoying!
I don't care. Of course, I'm an asshole. I don't care about abused animals, starving children elsewhere in the world, or anything else. I only care about the gun violence because of how it could affect my freedoms in expressing myself in game development. I only care about FSH Muscular Dystrophy out of all the MDs because my wife and son have it.
@L B, BHXSpecter
It's normal to be disinterested in things that don't affect you. Notice how practically everyone who starts a charity for people with a disease does it for a disease they or their friends or family also have (Christopher Reeve, for example). Most people only feign interest in things that don't affect them. The rest are interested because they think their god will reward them, feel guilty about having more than others, or they just think that's how people should behave. In all three cases the person is fulfilling their own desire to go to heaven, to feel less guilty, or to be a good person. It's never about the affected person.
@L B
It's just a lack of empathy, it's not something to feel ashamed about. You aren't causing animals to suffer or enabling others to cause animals to suffer (I assume), so you aren't doing anything wrong. You're not doing anything about it, either, but neither is she (again, I assume). Empathy is worthless if it doesn't result in action. If she looks away, it's only because the human brain is programmed to get away from things that repulse it. That's why people will turn or look away from bad sights and smells, or wrinkle/cover their noses in disgust, often sub-consciously.
@BHXSpecter
Blunt affect and apathy are caused by depression. You aren't an asshole, you have a medical condition. You support a disabled wife and child. That's not something an asshole would do.
It's normal to be disinterested in things that don't affect you. Notice how practically everyone who starts a charity for people with a disease does it for a disease they or their friends or family also have (Christopher Reeve, for example). Most people only feign interest in things that don't affect them. The rest are interested because they think their god will reward them, feel guilty about having more than others, or they just think that's how people should behave. In all three cases the person is fulfilling their own desire to go to heaven, to feel less guilty, or to be a good person. It's never about the affected person.
@L B
It's just a lack of empathy, it's not something to feel ashamed about. You aren't causing animals to suffer or enabling others to cause animals to suffer (I assume), so you aren't doing anything wrong. You're not doing anything about it, either, but neither is she (again, I assume). Empathy is worthless if it doesn't result in action. If she looks away, it's only because the human brain is programmed to get away from things that repulse it. That's why people will turn or look away from bad sights and smells, or wrinkle/cover their noses in disgust, often sub-consciously.
@BHXSpecter
Blunt affect and apathy are caused by depression. You aren't an asshole, you have a medical condition. You support a disabled wife and child. That's not something an asshole would do.
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closed account (iw0XoG1T)
@chisname
I have worked with many charities and I can assure you that most people give because they enjoy helping others. They give neither out of a sense of guilt or because they feel obligated. Most people give anonymously and no one but the charity ever knows.
I also hang out with religious people and I have never met someone who gives because they expect a reward. You are right, this is taught by some televangelist but I have never met someone personally who gives for this reason.
Also church giving is very exaggerated the average church attender gives 1 to 3% of their income to charity. And that percentage is for all giving not just to the church. This study is done yearly and the figures never change much.
My wife has been raising funds for charity for close to thirty years--because she is in the business I have met many people who give charitably. I have even seen a Jewish organization donate to a Christian organization that requires all of their employees be Christian.
There really are good people in this world. To say people give because they "think that is how they should behave" infers that people believe that they are obligated to give. That is not correct.
Don't believe me ask some atheist why they give to a charities? I guarantee that the reason you will hear most often is they give because they enjoy helping others.
Today is Martin Luther King Day here in the US and many people today will donate their time to helping others--and there is no reward for doing this.
| Most people only feign interest in things that don't affect them. The rest are interested because they think their god will reward them, feel guilty about having more than others, or they just think that's how people should behave. |
I have worked with many charities and I can assure you that most people give because they enjoy helping others. They give neither out of a sense of guilt or because they feel obligated. Most people give anonymously and no one but the charity ever knows.
I also hang out with religious people and I have never met someone who gives because they expect a reward. You are right, this is taught by some televangelist but I have never met someone personally who gives for this reason.
Also church giving is very exaggerated the average church attender gives 1 to 3% of their income to charity. And that percentage is for all giving not just to the church. This study is done yearly and the figures never change much.
My wife has been raising funds for charity for close to thirty years--because she is in the business I have met many people who give charitably. I have even seen a Jewish organization donate to a Christian organization that requires all of their employees be Christian.
There really are good people in this world. To say people give because they "think that is how they should behave" infers that people believe that they are obligated to give. That is not correct.
Don't believe me ask some atheist why they give to a charities? I guarantee that the reason you will hear most often is they give because they enjoy helping others.
Today is Martin Luther King Day here in the US and many people today will donate their time to helping others--and there is no reward for doing this.
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| chrisname wrote: |
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| @BHXSpecter Blunt affect and apathy are caused by depression. You aren't an asshole, you have a medical condition. You support a disabled wife and child. That's not something an asshole would do. |
Well the depression didn't happen til recently with college, debt, and son's health issues. I've always been an asshole though, just not on a few things. You can ask my wife or anyone else that knows me and they will flat out tell you I'm an asshole.
| chwsks wrote: |
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| Today is Martin Luther King Day here in the US and many people today will donate their time to helping others--and there is no reward for doing this. |
Psychology says you are wrong. Self gratification, everyone helps others because it selfishly makes them feel better. I'm afraid chrisname is right, people only help for a limited number of reasons and those who seem to give because they are "good" are actually doing it because it gives them a sense of feeling needed and feel good. When that feeling stops they find another cause to help with to get that emotional high again.
| ResidentBiscuit wrote: |
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| Part of me wants to be that stubborn (no offence) but then part of me has to be logical and realize that it isn't normal (or everyone fakes it and is afraid to admit it) and something had to cause it. I can't remember being not like I am now either, but I was very young when it started. |
Sorry for offtopic but can you answer to my PM? I don't know how to contact with you :(
closed account (3qX21hU5)
I have to agree with chwsks on this one. I also believe most people give just because they like to see other people happy, or just like giving.
One time I won a little bit of money from the casino. Now my girlfriend parents at that time were going through a very hard time and needed to make their house payment or risk going into forclosure. They didn't have the money and never asked either my girlfriend or me for it, but I still wanted to help them out. So I stuck some money into a envelop and put it through the little mail slot in their door one night. I never told them I gave that to them, but I think they knew one of us did it.
Now I didn't do it because they were kind of related to me, or for some other motive. I did it because they were good people and would do anything they could for someone they didn't even know that good. And I will never regret giving away that much money and never asking for it to be paid back because well it made me feel good to help someone.
You can't deny that there is a good feeling you get when you give something to others. It doesn't matter weather it is just giving your time at a soup kitchen, or donating thousands of dollars to a charity.
One time I won a little bit of money from the casino. Now my girlfriend parents at that time were going through a very hard time and needed to make their house payment or risk going into forclosure. They didn't have the money and never asked either my girlfriend or me for it, but I still wanted to help them out. So I stuck some money into a envelop and put it through the little mail slot in their door one night. I never told them I gave that to them, but I think they knew one of us did it.
Now I didn't do it because they were kind of related to me, or for some other motive. I did it because they were good people and would do anything they could for someone they didn't even know that good. And I will never regret giving away that much money and never asking for it to be paid back because well it made me feel good to help someone.
You can't deny that there is a good feeling you get when you give something to others. It doesn't matter weather it is just giving your time at a soup kitchen, or donating thousands of dollars to a charity.
closed account (iw0XoG1T)
| BHXSpector wrote: |
|---|
| Psychology says you are wrong. |
Psychology is a soft-science; that said, Psychology never said anything because there is no theory of Psychology. A psychologist might say I am wrong, but not all psychologists would say I am wrong.
So please tell me who you are quoting or paraphrasing when you say "everyone helps others because it selfishly makes them feel better". I'll bet dollars to donuts that there is little or no testing of that statement, i.e. evidence that either backs that statement up or can disprove it.
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@chwsks, Zereo
What both of you just said proves my point. I didn't say people only give for selfish/bad reasons, but they always give to fulfil their own desire . It isn't necessarily bad. I think that giving because you feel it makes you a good person, not because you feel obligated to give, but because you want to be a good person and you believe generosity is a part of that is a good reason to give. Also, I'm sure that the needy generally don't question the motives of the people that help them.
To be fair, it's kind of a truism since no-one really does anything without some form of desire or motive, so there wasn't much point saying it.
What both of you just said proves my point. I didn't say people only give for selfish/bad reasons, but they always give to fulfil their own desire . It isn't necessarily bad. I think that giving because you feel it makes you a good person, not because you feel obligated to give, but because you want to be a good person and you believe generosity is a part of that is a good reason to give. Also, I'm sure that the needy generally don't question the motives of the people that help them.
To be fair, it's kind of a truism since no-one really does anything without some form of desire or motive, so there wasn't much point saying it.