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closed account (zb0S216C)
You're deviating away from the problem.

Bucky's tutorials are teaching bad habits, giving terrible information, over condensing information and [he's] clearly rushing tutorials. This sort of behaviour impacts negatively on beginner programmers which in turn leads to sub-standard programming on their part -- irrespective of whether one programs as a hobby or as a profession.

Moreover, regardless of how information is presented -- be it videos, lectures, etcetera -- bad habits and incorrect information are easily conveyed to the student.

closed account (3qX21hU5)
Learning the correct difinitions in programming if not that hard. Students can easily learn the correct term for a object while they are still learning if they have a good resource to learn from. Take variables for example. When teaching someone the basics of programming would you just say call variables whatever you want or use some other word for them? No you would teach them the correct term and teach them exactly what they do. The same goes for other terminology in programming. It is very important to know the correct terminology or else you will have a very very hard time working with other programmers. Also it is much better to teach them the correct names while they are still learning then have the go back and relearn everything ("Cant teach a old dog new tricks" type of thing).

And if it works for the hobby programmer for whatever said programmer is doing thats the way he does his hobby, Its not gonna make expert programmers go all stupid and its not gonna lower any standards for any experts who know what they're doing

The problem is not how the hobby programmer does his programming. Some people are just sub par programmers and won't get any better. What is the problem is that bucky is TEACHING people sub par programming. There is a difference, one only affects usually one person while the other can affects many people. The people learning from bucky's videos probably think they are programming exactly how everyone else does and don't know they are learning bad habits. So either they continues using them bad habits and it hurts them by only letting them produce bad coding and programs, or they find out that they were taught wrong and have to relearn how to do everything right. Either way it is hurting them in the long run.

So instead of saying well atleast they are learning even though it is teaching them bad habits, you could save them the trouble they will have later and redirect them to someone that can teach them the right way or a resource that can.
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I suppose they are like pop programming tutorials, well once i learned buckies stuff i used it to understand reading material that could not be understood by itself, i suppose you guys are right, I have changed my mind, but i can use his tutorials as a study aid...I remember how when i had trouble with pointers buckies tutorials didnt realy touch on that, had to learn for myself anyway.

You guys know what fundemental I most likley missed out on the most??

Recomend a good alternative to bucky?

recomend a learnin book that assumes you know nothing and doesnt straight jump into you being an expert too soon (C++ for dummies)

Im going to study computer science soon from foundation, that will cement the holes, I look foward to better understanding and deeper programmin conversations with you guys :D
closed account (zb0S216C)
devonrevenge wrote:
"I remember how when i had trouble with pointers buckies tutorials didnt realy touch on that"

See what I mean?

devonrevenge wrote:
"Recomend a good alternative to bucky?"

As it stands, there are no alternatives to Bucky's videos. If you're an absolute beginner to C++, C++ for Dummies is a good book to begin with for a reasons; the main ones being:

● The book condenses information so that the reader understands the given information without compromising the information's validity.

● The book explains all concepts in C++ in a clear, structured way, but doesn't overwhelm the user with undue information.

When you've read that, I recommend a book such as C++ Primer, Programming Practices and Principles Using C++ or The C++ Programming Language. These books with teach you what the best practices are, how one should use the key concepts in which they were intended, give information that's to the point and relevant to the topic, and most importantly, are written by well respected programmers.

For further reading, More/Exceptional C++ and More/Effective C++ will teach you what goes on behind the scenes, what the compiler will and will not do in certain scenarios, and will show you the best way to do X.

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Oh good thanks framework ive been looking for an actual book for easy flicking through while working, on amazon now, i will def need these
I reported the OP because I honestly thought it was spam.

Reading the discussion now, I see it's not spam, but a tribute from one misguided person to another. I guess it's more ironic than spam, I mean.

I didn't learn C++ though video tutorials, nor some book, or even a class in school. I learned it from this website and from a few other people who offered help which is not horribly outdated.

Basically, I did lots of reading. LOTS of reading. I read stuff that I made sure was trustworthy and wasn't some misguided person misguiding other people, and to validate that I had to do more reading.

I think C++ and other programming can be taught in a video format, but that so far no one has been able to do it properly. If hired teachers can't even be expected to teach things properly, how can some random guy with a Youtube account be expected to?

The problem with a video format is that it can't easily be edited like a written post or article, and it easily fades with time.

Until a programming-genius lawyer with an excellent voice, teaching experience, and great video recording skills comes into existence, I don't think we're going to get good video programming tutorials.

To learn to program you have to read a lot. That's all it takes, is good reading skills. You don't have to be Autistic, you don't have to be mathematically talented, you don't have to be a logical thinker - they all help tremendously, but they're not required.

Reading comprehension skills are required.

Unlike with most things, practice doesn't make perfect. You can practice writing code all day, but if it's bad code, you just practiced writing bad code all day and only learned a couple good lessons.

You have to read about modern programming techniques, what you should and shouldn't do, etc, and bookmark the pages for reference because you're certainly not going to be able to remember all that in your head.

If you can't tell by now, I'm a strong believer in that reading is the key to everything. It seems to work for people of all brain styles, but the requirement is time and effort - some people need less, others need more - just read and don't think about the time and effort. If you can read, you can learn.
I Agree - Bucky teaches how to write a quick program IN C++, he does not teach you C++... I was reading a book, looking at the tutorials here, and then the other day I saw a link to Bucky, and watched a few of Bucky's videos. What I saw, made me think that what I had read was wrong, because he made it look "simple" . It wasn't. He over simplified concepts, left out terminology, he didn't even know the correct terminology for curly brackets.

This thread was originally to get a reaction from people because it is the lounge in the forum. It's not a real serious place. I merely thought his little tick was amusing.

Bucky - Your feminine Function is safe with me! haha

p.s. Would you guys recommend me reading Thinking in C++ or would you recommend I pass that up, because I'm having some trouble with it.
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I get all dyslexic arround books hence the need for bucky, i just will up the dose of ritalin and presto easy book reading, im laying of it at the mo and hardly studying at all, i think its just nerves about getting a uni place.
I think its imposible to learn straight from the book, or at least it is for me, you want to be playing with coding as you read, thas what i do, i even have a note book, i leave notes for what to go back and look in fursther, its also why java is stupid cos you dont have to know much programing, it seems to be all remembering.
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closed account (3qX21hU5)
devonrevenge wrote:
I get all dyslexic arround books hence the need for bucky, i just will up the dose of ritalin and presto easy book reading, im laying of it at the mo and hardly studying at all, i think its just nerves about getting a uni place.

You can only learn so much from video's, every programmer needs to be good at reading and usually they have to not hate reading. Don't think that after you know all the basics you won't ever have to read a programming book again. Programming is reading basically, its reading different documentations, reading up on new techniques, reading other peoples code, reading forums like these, reading game design documents, rereading parts of a book you marked for reference, and on and on. Also when you get into a university devon they will make you read from a book you won't learn everything in the lectures. I'm not saying you won't be able to do I think you could actually. I'm just saying that you should expect a WHOLE LOT more reading if you are going to pursue a career in programming.

devonrevenge wrote:
leave notes for what to go back and look in fursther

Notes are a always good to take specially when working on a big project. When working on a big project or even a medium one I personally use a mix of diagrams and word documents. The diagram will hold all the parts of a project I am working on and inside each part I will have a link or more that goes to the word files that documents everything that I have done on that part or need to do. I find its the best way for me to stay organized, but probably not the best for other people trying to figure out what I have done.

devonrevenge wrote:
its also why java is stupid cos you dont have to know much programing, it seems to be all remembering.

Its the exact same for C++. Once you start getting into Boost and the STL and every other library that programmers use daily it is almost impossible to remember everything. That is why you need reference material to look back at to remember how things are done. Hence we are always going to be reading and why videos aren't much help.
closed account (S6k9GNh0)
Actually, I'd say you can learn the same amount from videos as you can from text, especially something like youtube videos that are easily re-playable. However, Bucky's tutorials are definitely not one of those videos...

Either way, the need for reading is a must either way. You have to read code, read output, read debugger output, read documentation, read, read, read, and then read some more.
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